Journal Through the Ages

Mischa Borgnaes

Copyright 2014, The Electric Scroll

Smashwords Edition

All rights reserved. Published in the United States of America by The Electric Scroll. No part of this book may be reproduced or transmitted in any form or by any means, electronic or mechanical, including photocopying, recording, or by any information storage and retrieval system without written permission from the publisher. For information contact The Electric Scroll, 745 N. Gilbert Rd. suite 124 PMB 197, Gilbert, Arizona, 85234.

Printed in the United States of America.

The characters in this book are real, true, people. Any resemblance to real people, both living and dead, is on purpose. No names were changed to protect the innocent...

Parchment image on front and back covers courtesy of www.myfreetextures.com, used by permission.

Table of Contents

Title Page

Copyright Notice

Foreword

The Ancestors of Delbert Athel Thulin

Biography of Delbert Athel Thulin

Interview with Delbert Athel Thulin

Autobiography of Delbert Athel Thulin

Patriarchal Blessing of Delbert Athel Thulin

Special Family Songs

The George Ingerman Thulin Story

Autobiography of Sarah Ethel Peck

Martin Horton Peck

Life Story of Martin Horton Peck

Patriarchal Blessing of Martin Horton Peck

Military Record of Philip Peck

Joseph Peck, the Ancestor

The Ancestors of Shirley Adelle Ashby

Personal Record of Shirley Adelle Ashby

Patriarchal Blessing of Shirley Adelle Ashby

Diaries Kept by Shirley Adelle Ashby

An Interview with Shirley Adelle Ashby

Eulogy of Shirley Adelle Ashby

John William Ashby

Autobiography of Benjamin Ashby

Nathaniel Ashby Life Sketch

Sketch of the life of William Felshaw and Mary Harriet Gilbert

From the Journal of Joseph Smith Jr.

Record Kept by Brigham Young

Celestia Lavina Van Leuven

Obituaries of Charles Henry Pitts

Obituaries of Ida Wuthrich Pitts

Edmond Durfee

Descendants of Delbert Athel Thulin and Shirley Adelle Ashby

The Children

The Grandchildren

Foreword

I don't usually write nonfiction, but I certainly feel impressed to compile this book and make it available for the rapidly expanding members of our extended family. The compulsion stems from an experience I had in Nauvoo on July 20, 2009.

First, it should be noted that I usually refer to long dead ancestors as my however-many great grandfather, citing their relationship to me, rather than my relationship to them.

We began the day by breaking camp. We had camped that night in the Shimek State Forest, in Iowa, about two miles from Farmington, which is not far from Bonaparte. According to Benjamin Ashby's autobiography, the family camped six miles west of Bonaparte, and remained there for about a week, during which time his father Nathaniel died. Nathaniel has a headstone in the Salt Lake City Cemetery he shares with his wife, which states he died near Bonaparte, Iowa.

We took the modern road west out of Bonaparte, and some six miles later came to a town named Bentonsport. While exploring the historic downtown district, we came upon a lovely park on the banks of the Des Moines River. Here, we experienced a very strong feeling that this was where Nathaniel died.

From there, we drove to Nauvoo, where we had only about half an hour to spend. We located and photographed the Ashby Snow house, and the Joseph Smith Mansion house. We did a little shopping in the reconstructed Joseph Smith Red Brick Store. We visited the blacksmith shop, which would have been very like Martin Peck's shop, but this particular one belonged to the Webb family.

We drove east out of Nauvoo, up the hill to the historical cemetery. As we got out of the car, I joked with my Mom that we had no need to fear ghosts in this cemetery, because they were all family.

We walked over a bridge across a small stream, to a beautiful little gazebo with solid walls, where the names of those buried in the cemetery are all listed. From there you walk up wood stairs, and immediately in front of you is a single modern tombstone, bearing the names of Edmond Durfee and Magdalena Pickle. The rest of the cemetery still bears the original headstones some hundred and fifty years old at this writing, and mostly illegible.

While standing there, a tour group entered the cemetery, and one of the members asked the guide about the modern stone. The guide replied to the effect that she had heard he was killed in a battle.

Before I really knew what I was doing, I had turned toward them and walked halfway to where they stood. I introduced myself as Edmond's granddaughter, and asked if they'd like to hear his story. They both said yes, and I gave them a condensed version of it. They were most grateful, and I was very humbled.

I had often thought of the deceased's relationship to me, but never of my relationship to them. It was so out of character for me to phrase it that way; that I was his granddaughter. I know he was pleased that day that his granddaughter was there to tell his story.

As we drove away, I felt strongly that I really needed to quit procrastinating, and get our family history stories published, for the edification of all the family members. I pray that something in the experiences of our ancestors will help to strengthen your testimony of the gospel, and give you the strength you need in your time of trial.

A note about how the book is organized:

The intent of the book is to tell about the family of Delbert and Shirley Thulin, their ancestors, and their descendants. It should be noted that this is an ongoing work in progress, and this book can only be made from information currently available to me. I have done my best to compile complete and accurate information.

I am including direct line individuals through the sixth generation up from Delbert and Shirley, and the second generation down.

The book has three sections: Delbert's ancestors, Shirley's ancestors, and their descendants. In each section, I will give genealogical information on the ancestors, followed by the stories I have been able to collect and assemble.

I am not putting out another general call for submissions as I have done in the past, but I will include information gleaned from such past calls. It should be noted in the section on the descendants that some years ago I asked each of Delbert & Shirley's children for two things: to send me stories they remembered from growing up, and to tell me about each of their children. Some gave me more information than others. I've included what was sent to me, but there is definitely more on some people than there is on others.

Also please note that pictures and ebooks don't get along very well. Therefore, the ebook version of this book does not contain the many photographs that enhance the pages of the print version.

Respectfully Submitted,

Mischa Borgnaes

Family Historian

The Ancestors of Delbert Athel Thulin

Generation 1

Delbert Athel Thulin

Born 25 Aug 1917, Ogden, Weber, Utah

Married 8 Apr 1939, Kaysville, Davis, Utah

Died 19 Aug 1997, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Generation 2

The Parents of Delbert Athel Thulin:

George Ingerman Thulin

Born 7 Jun 1889, Eau Claire, Eau Claire, Wisconsin

Married 6 Jul 1908, Logan, Cache, Utah

Died 10 Sep 1970, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Sarah Ethel Peck

Born 20 Jan 1891, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Died 12 Oct 1954, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Generation 3

The Parents of George Ingerman Thulin:

Anton Julius Thulin

Born 14 Feb 1864, Horton, Aker, Norway

Married 24 Dec 1885 Eau Claire, Eau Claire, Wisconsin

Died 9 Sep 1949, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Hansine Hansen

Born 18 Feb 1860, Fredrickstad, Wallo Tunico, Norway

Died 28 Jun 1880, Duluth, Saint Louis, Minnesota

The Parents of Sarah Ethel Peck:

Dorr Peck

Born 10 Feb 1861, Provo, Utah, Utah

Married 25 Dec 1884, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Died 10 Dec 1914, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Sarah Ann Matthews

Born 18 Jan 1860, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Died 17 Jun 1893, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Generation 4

The Parents of Anton Julius Thulin:

Johan Martinius Thulin (aka John Martin Thulin)

Born 21 Oct 1836, Cristiania, Aker, Norway

Married 4 Nov 1860, Cristiania, Aker, Norway

Died Abt April 1914, Philadelphia, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania

Gunda Olsen

Born 6 Dec 1836, Cristiania, Aker, Norway

Died 30 Sep 1919, Logan, Cache, Utah

The Parents of Hansine Hansen:

Peter Hansen

Born Abt 1834, Wallo Tunico, Ostfold, Norway

Died Abt 1859, Wallo Tunico, Ostfold, Norway

Ingebor Irailson

Born Abt 1838, Wallo Tunico, Ostfold, Norway

Died Abt 1859, Wallo Tunico, Ostfold, Norway

The Parents of Dorr Peck:

Martin Horton Peck

Born 27 May 1806, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Married 12 Feb 1851, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Died 17 Jun 1884, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Charlotte Amelia VanOrden

Born 13 Jan 1828, Windham, Greene, New York

Died 13 Sep 1895, Provo, Utah, Utah

The Parents of Sarah Ann Matthews:

Richard Matthews

Born 29 Dec 1835, Radford, Nottingham, England

Married 31 Mar 1859, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Died 17 Mar 1906, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Mary Ann Saunders

Born 5 Oct 1840, Soham, Cambridge, England

Died 10 Feb 1891, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Generation 5

The Parents of Johan Martinius Thulin:

Johan Petter Thulin

Born 30 Aug 1797, Ulfforsen, Glava, Varmlands, Sweden

Died Abt 1 Oct 1863, Aker, Norway

Marthe Hansen

Born 19 May 1803, Drobak, Sundby, Norway

Died 24 Apr 1869, Cristinia, Aker, Norway

The Parents of Gunda Olsen:

Ole Olsen

Born 24 Jun 1799, Nannestad, Okun, Norway

Died 24 Apr 1869, Fjermestad, Time, Rogaland, Norway

Berte Johnson

Born 6 Apr 1800, Nannestad, Okun, Norway

Died Abt 1875

The Parents of Martin Horton Peck:

Ebenezer Peck III

Born 8 Mar 1784, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Married 28 Jul 1805, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Died 27 Jun 1851, Lyndon, Caledonia, Vermont

Nancy Horton

Born 27 Aug 1787, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Died 29 May 1835, Lyndon, Caledonia, Vermont

The Parents of Charlotte Amelia VanOrden:

William VanOrden

Born 15 Nov 1804, Cairo, Greene, New York

Married 12 Mar 1827, Windom (Windsor), Greene, New York

Died 14 Jul 1844, Nauvoo, Hancock, Illinois

Julia Ann Haight

Born 6 Oct 1805, Windham, Greene, New York

Died 23 Jan 1865, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

The Parents of Richard Matthews:

William Matthews

Born 14 Oct 1809, Radford, Nottingham, England

Married 31 Dec 1832, Radford, Nottingham, England

Died 12 Aug 1874, Salt lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Hepzibah Jarvis

Born 3 Mar 1810, Radford, Nottingham, England

Died 8 Jan 1879, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

The Parents of Mary Ann Saunders:

William Gimbert Saunders

Born 10 Jan 1819, Soham, Cambridge, England

Married 11 Nov 1839, Soham, Cambridge, England

Died 9 Jun 1888, Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah

Phoebe Merrell

Born 7 Jun 1817, Littleport, Cambridge, England

Died 8 Sep 1871, Ogden, Weber, Utah

Generation 6

The Parents of Johan Petter Thulin:

Pal Tholin

Born 1762, Konungariket, Norway

Married Langserud, Varmlands, Sweden

Anna Nilssen

Born 24 Jan 1773, Skog, Gilberga, Varmlands, Sweden

Died Langserud, Varmlands, Sweden

The Parents of Marthe Hansen:

Hans Gundersen

Born 3 Aug 1755, Bragnaes, Bond, Norway

Kersti Larsen

Born 17 Jun 1786, Holtbrek, Hurum, Norway

The Parents of Ole Olsen:

Ole Kristoffersen

Born 1 Jul 1770, Nannestad, Hegli, Norway

Marte Johnson

Born 10 Feb 1765, Nannestad, Lovaas, Norway

The Parents of Berte Johnson:

Jon Larsen

Born 6 Mar 1775, Nannestad, Aastad, Norway

Anne Kristensen

Born 8 May 1777, Nannestad, Brostad, Norway

The Parents of Ebenezer Peck III:

Philip Peck

Born 25 Apr 1747, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Married 5 Jul 1768, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Died 6 Apr 1805, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Ruth Williams

Born 1749, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Died 12 Jan 1830, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

The Parents of Nancy Horton:

William Horton

Born 21 Apr 1745, Swanwsea, Bristol, Massachusetts

Married 30 Nov 1770, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Died 19 Jul 1798, Rehoboth, Bristol, Massachusetts

Content Brayton

Born 3 Jun 1744, Tiverton, Newport, Rhode Island

Died 28 Jan 1820, Killinsgly, Windham, Connecticut

The Parents of William VanOrden:

Peter VanOrden

Born 10 Feb 1761, Catskill, Green, New York

Married 15 Jul 1804

Died 15 Jul 1841, Windham, Green, New York

Mary Crooker

Born 31 Jul 1774, Rye, Westchester, New York

Died 29 Mar 1848, Windham, Green, New York

The Parents of Julia Ann Haight:

Caleb Haight

Born 28 Aug 1778, Amenia, New York

Died June 6, 1851, Salt Lake City, Utah

Keturah Horton

Born 11 Feb 1977, Dutchess County, New York

The Parents of William Matthews:

Richard Matthews

Born Abt 1781, Radford, Nottingham, England

Married 14 Jan, 1805, St. Mary's, Nottingham, England

Died 25 Jun 1822, St. Mary's, Nottingham, England

Elizabeth Byron

Born Abt 1787, Radford, Nottingham, England

Died 13 May, 1843, St. Mary's, Nottingham, England

The Parents of Hepzibah Jarvis:

Joseph Jarvis

Born 22 Jul 1768, St. Mary's, Nottingham, England

Married 26 Dec 1791, St. Mary's, Nottingham, England

Died 20 Jan 1837, Union Work House, Radford, Nottingham, England

Mary Beardsley

Born 1769, Radford, Nottingham, England

Died 22 Apr 1841, Oxton, Nottingham, England

The Parents of William Gimbert Saunders:

Charles Saunders

Mary Levet

The Parents of Phoebe Merrell:

John Merrell

Born Abt 1791

Died 1851, Downham, Cambridge, England

Mary

Born Abt 1793

Biography of Delbert Athel Thulin

Delbert was born of goodly parents, George Ingerman Thulin and Sarah Ethel Peck. The Thulin side of the family comes mostly from Norway. His Grandfather, Anton Julius Thulin was the immigrant who brought the family to the United States. The Peck family is from England. The Peck's immigrant ancestor, Joseph, was a member of the upper class of English society, ranking between a baronet and a knight. Upon immigrating he settled in Massachusetts, where the family stayed until joining the church and moving eventually to Salt Lake City.

Delbert was blessed September 30, 1917 by Walter W. Crarce. He was baptized shortly after his eighth birthday, on August 30, 1925 by a priest, Lewis F. Weight, and confirmed the same day by Elder J. W. Goodman.

On October 24, 1932, Delbert submitted a pedigree chart, which recorded his address as being 1129 Bueno Avenue, in Salt Lake City.

Delbert was ordained to the Priesthood as a deacon by G. S. McAllister on February 5, 1933 at the age of 16. In March, on the 6th, William H. Gibbs gave Delbert his Patriarchal blessing. On April 2, Joseph F. Everett ordained him a teacher.

Delbert attended West High School, and retained school spirit throughout much of his life, telling his children when their school was to play West, that the Panthers would spit in their teams eyes and drown them. When the children returned home after winning the game, they would reply that West must have run out of spit.

Delbert met his sweetheart, Shirley Adelle Ashby at Wasatch Springs, a public swimming pool. When they had been engaged a while, on the night he gave Shirley her diamond, they told his family that they had eloped, as a joke. The family called and telegrammed all the out of town relatives before they could explain that they were joking. Rather than call everyone back, Delbert's family decreed that the pair must get married the next day to save face. They were able to find an open court house in Kaysville, Utah. As they walked up the steps, Delbert picked Shirley a bouquet of lilacs. They were married on April 8, 1939.

The couple set up housekeeping, and soon their children began to arrive. Dan, born April 11, 1940, was first.

On March 23, 1941, William C. Luker ordained Delbert to the Melchizedek Priesthood, and the office of an Elder. On their second anniversary, April 8, 1941 Delbert and Shirley were sealed in the Temple and Dan was sealed to them. The rest of the children were born in the covenant.

Gary was born September 13, 1941, in Los Angeles. He was the only one of the children not born in Salt Lake. Bill was born May 29, 1951. Pat was born April 2, 1945. Shirley often said that she was still groggy when the doctor came in and told her it was a girl. She thought he was pulling an April Fool's joke, because at the time there were a lot of boys being born.

Delbert was away in the Navy, as it was the middle of World War II. Pat was about 4 months old when she first met her Daddy, and she was a little afraid of him at first.

Mike was born on May 24, 1947, followed by Joie on August 14, 1948.

Delbert was ordained to the office of a Seventy on September 6, 1949 by Elder Bruce R. McConkie.

Tom came along May 9, 1951, and brother Ron followed on June 24, 1953. Karen was an early Valentine present, arriving on the 10th of February, 1956.

Jimmy was born May 13, 1958, and died October 27, 1963 from a tumor in his brain. His pioneering of the use of shunts for people older than babies will be appreciated by many for years to come.

Cindy was born May 13, 1958, and lived only two days. Her older sister told me that there just wasn't enough material there to make a whole baby. How joyful it will be when we are all reunited with our loved ones for eternity. Then everyone will be perfect in body and mind.

Delbert worked as a miner until there was an accident that cost his brother Marvin the use of his legs. Shirley tells of moving to the mining town of Bingham, Utah, where she noticed that no one had any pictures on their walls. She soon found out why. When they blasted the mine at the end of the day, all the pictures would fall off the walls. She also said that if she started dinner when she heard the blast, the timing worked out just about right so that it would be done just as Delbert got home.

Delbert later worked as an iron worker, welding just about everything. It's fun to drive under a freeway bridge (or over it) and have someone tell you that Grandpa made the bridge. He also made ornate wrought iron gates for some of the wealthier homes in Salt Lake. He helped build the tram-way at Bridal Veil Falls in Provo Canyon, one of the steepest trams in the world

He worked on the hydroelectric power plant in Paige, Arizona, and also on the Palo Verde Nuclear power plant in Buckeye, Arizona. He was so adept at fixing things that one day when his daughter tore her dress, she asked him to weld it so that Mom wouldn't find out it had been torn.

Some of his church callings have been: Scoutmaster in the 9th ward, General Secretary in the 9th ward, 1st counselor to Stake Genealogy Brother Mertz in Liberty Stake; President of the Elders Quorum in 34th ward; President of the Genealogy committee in 34th Ward; Stake missionary from Bryan Ward in 1951; Teacher of fireside group on West Side; Teacher of investigators group in Bryan Ward; and one of the Seventies Presidents.

In addition he has served a full time proselyting mission in Venice Florida, and a full time genealogy mission working in the family history vaults up in Big Cottonwood Canyon. He has also volunteered many hours at the church history museum.

Delbert died August 19, 2007, in Salt Lake City, Utah. He was buried on his 80th birthday. Following the funeral was the family luncheon. We filled the entire cultural hall. Delbert and Shirley Thulin had given life and the Gospel to enough descendants to make their very own ward. We sang happy birthday to Grandpa, followed by the family's special birthday song, and everyone was pretty much in tears. Then Dan said it was the first time Grandpa had heard the song in years, and we all broke out laughing and proceeded to have a wonderful family reunion. It was the first time in 25 years that all nine of Del and Shirley's living children had been gathered in the same room. I'm pretty sure Jimmy and Cindy were there too.

An interview with Delbert Athel Thulin.

by Mischa Borgnaes

Mischa Borgnaes: What's the first house you remember living in? What was it like?

Delbert Athel Thulin: It was a house in Ogden, Utah. It seems to me it was a two story house, anyway, it was a big house. And it had a garden out in the side of it, and one of these pumps that you would pump the water, you had to prime the thing every day, to prime it so it would pump the water out, then you had to pump it, like a pump handle, so they say, and that's how they got the water. They'd always keep a pan full of water to dump down in the top of the pump so that there wasn't a lot of air. And then it would work. It would pump the water out. I remember that we had coal oil lamps, kerosene lamps, and they told me about me setting the kitchen table on fire by pulling the tablecloth off, and they had to douse it all out and stop it. I was too little, but it seems that I've heard it told about and told about, till it seems like I can remember it.

MB: Sometimes things are like that.

DAT: Yes. But I remember that where the pump would spill the water out, it was on old cast iron pump and it had a handle on it that must have been about eighteen inches long or so, anyway, you pump it and it would lift the water up and then you'd water the garden, there was room enough for a garden alongside the house. I remember that the worms were around the moisture in the yard, and it seems like they was the most hideous things that ever was, and I thought they was gonna get me.

MB: I never liked worms either. What kind of chores did you have when you were growing up? What chores did you have to do, around the house?

DAT: Toys?

MB: Chores. What work did you have to do around the house? What chores?

DAT: Oh, chores?

MB: Yeah.

DAT: I was too small to...When we moved to Silver City. From Ogden we moved to Silver City, where my Father got a job night watching for the mine in Eureka, which was just away from Silver City, about four or five miles. Anyway, we moved up there, we had coal and we had to cut the wood and get the wood and coal in, and my job was to get the wood in, or to get the coal... I think it was to get the wood in, to start the coal. And wood and coal burnt in the stoves, and if I didn't get out, they had to take time to get it in the morning. If for some reason they didn't have enough to start the fire, they'd get me up, and I had to go out and cut some of the small branches, and carry the wood and it was my job to get the coal in. That was the first job I ever had to do. And the first quarter I ever earned, the first money I ever earned was when I in the second, I think, or the third grade. I'd say about the third grade. There was a lady in the town had me help her clean out the root cellar. It was out by the side of her house, and I had to clean it up, clean out down there, and there was these bugs that roll up in a ball...

MB: Potato bugs.

DAT: Potato bugs, anyway, on the shelves, there were some of those in there, and I had to clean them out and then I got a quarter, twenty-five cents, that was the first time I ever got any money for doing anything.

MB: How old were you then?

DAT: Oh, I was about in the third grade, I think. Maybe second grade, but it was a deal between my parents and this lady. I think she was a widow.

MB: Were your parents pretty strict with you kids as you were all growing up? Or did they let you get away with everything?

DAT: I look back, and I think that they just let me grow, but I know that they were strict with me. I wore high button shoes, the first year I went to school. I had my own private button hook to hook them up...

MB: How does a button hook work?

DAT: It was just a piece of steel about three inches long, and it had a little hook. and you'd reach in through the button hole and you'd twist the hook around, so that you pulled that button right through that hole.

MB: I've seen button hooks, but I never figured out how they worked.

DAT: I've got one at home somewhere. We each one of us had our own button hook to get our shoes on in the morning. And the first year I went to school, I never went to kindergarten, they didn't have that, the year that I started school, my sister Margaret was two years older than me, and she would go the first half of the day, and then come home from lunch, and we lived a mile from the school. The first year I had button hook shoes and the second year I had sandals. When school was over, then you'd take your shoes off and run barefoot, till it got school time.

The principal of our school was a man by the name of Thomas William Dikes. And he taught the upper two classes, and the kids higher than that, this was an elementary school, the kids higher than that graduated I guess from Junior High school would go to Eureka. They had busses to take them over. We was called Silver City, the whole Silver, and Eureka, and Mammoth, and Dividend, and Miceville and all were called Tintic Junction because the railroad went through down at the bottom of the town. Down about a mile or so west of the town.

Anyway, we moved in there, and they had three Shay locomotive engines, and they would pull the regular cars up around the mountains on a narrow gauge railroad. And they had a roundhouse, they had a mill that took care of the ore. The ore was from Tintic, from Silver City on up. It was quite a lot of people in there according to me, but as I look back I can see that there weren't many people, there may have been oh... sixty, seventy people I guess in the town of Silver City.

After I left, the depression come on, it just wasted away, there's nothing more than just a ghost town now. However, Eureka is still going strong there. When I moved to Silver City, I remember I was about four years old. They didn't have a kindergarten, so I started the first grade, and they taught us all. They had an indoor toilet in the brick building. And outside they had an outdoor toilet that was made of wood and had two sections and it was a regular old outhouse, I think it was one toilet on each side.

MB: Did you ever get a splinter from the outhouse?

DAT: Splinter? Course not. How would you get a splinter...you mean sitting on it?

MB: Yeah.

DAT: You sit down carefully, and you got your clothes. Our toilet tissue was always Sears-Roebuck catalogs. Or a Monkey Ward, Montgomery Ward. And we'd get these Sears Catalogs, and tear up a sheet or two at a time. It was just over a hole...they's dig a hole just like you see pictures of it. But then you'd get in there and use those toilets in all kinds of weather. And the toilet we had behind my house, they were always in the back yard, it was a three holer. I and my two brothers could each one of us use it one hole at a time. We'd sit on there when we had to use it and whistle in there, and it was cold. And in the morning you'd have to get up and go out to the toilet. They'd get up in the morning and start a fire in the stove, then everybody'd get up, and my mother'd make us oatmeal mush or else this Germade which is like Cream of Wheat. I didn't like that, but I could get more sugar on it. So we'd eat it, we's glad to get anything.

My Dad worked as a night watchman for about four or five years, I don't remember how many, I was too small anyway. But I went to first... the principal that was the head of the school, his wife taught the first and second grade students. She had the class divided into sections. I think it was in a two story building, and I think it was a block building, or a brick building.

MB: How did you learn, and when did you learn your iron working and welding and that?

DAT: I did this after I left school, I went down to West High School, but I never completed High School. We only had elementary school, and then you'd get Junior High, and then you'd get High School. There was four grades there, the first year you were a freshman, and the second year you'd be in junior high, and then that's where they started this articulation, moving room to room. Some of these schools they didn't, they just had the groups of children and one teacher would teach first and second, and the second would teach third and fourth, and then fifth and sixth, and then they went to Junior High School, and went on over to Eureka.

MB: So you learned welding in High School?

DAT: I learned to weld at University of Utah, at night school. I did this during the war, it was after... I quit school and went to work in the mines. I did a man's work, and I did hard work, and I worked up in Bingham, Utah.

MB: That's another city that doesn't exist anymore.

DAT: That's right. I lived up there, too. And I used to drive Salt Lake up to Bingham, and then work a shift, and then go get in the car and we would have car pools and drive clear back down, it was twenty-six miles, one way. Then I would work around in the mines, go right down underground. I had to have a hard hat. I worked with dynamite, and I learned how to run jackhammers and timber until I could do everything in the mine, as far as work. I worked in the mines three and four and five hundred feet underground, up to one place, you go in the mine, in the Butterfield Tunnel, and it was eighteen hundred feet there, to the portal of the door, and you'd go up, and have small rails, and you'd sit on a little, what they called a man train and go clear on in there to where the hoist had been brought in and there was hoists at various levels. I did that, and I worked with my brother Einar, and my Uncle Don, Donald Peck.

My Father worked in the mines out in Silver City, but not steady at all, he was a night watchman to keep thieves out and people who'd steal lumber and coal, and steal the coal off the locomotives. They'd keep one of these locomotives running all the time, and overhaul the others, and they had it so they could have two locomotives working.

MB: And the locomotives pulled the ore out of the mine?

DAT: They'd go right up, they'd have to wind up amongst the mountains, then they'd sink shafts and run tunnels in, and people from Silver City and Eureka, that was the main work.

MB: You told me that you were building the tram at Bridal Veil Falls, and two guys would each put one foot in a bucket and get hauled up to the top of the cliff?

DAT: No, we did that, stand in the bucket and that at Pioche, Nevada, when I worked down there, but [at Bridal Veil] we had a skiff, what we called a skiff, which was a little car that was made of one by and two by fours and some two by ten inch planks, and this had a pulley and it was run on a cable and I only worked there about a month, month and a half, on the Bridal Veil Falls Sky Ride, but we almost got killed there, I and Alvin Whitehead.

MB: What happened?

DAT: I was working for Alvin Whitehead, and his company. Well, we had some snow that was in the machine, that was the hoist machine, and in the winter, it was about in March or February. Over the weekend, and when we come back it had snowed, and froze in there, and water trickled down in that machinery and when we went to run it was all frozen and it wouldn't move. And we were standing right down in there between where the hoist engines sit, alongside the road, and the cable went up and around a block of concrete that they poured up on the top, and then the cable stretched on down again, it was a regular cable car arrangement, like they have in Switzerland.

Well just all of a sudden that thing thawed out and it come spinning off, and if we had been a couple of seconds longer, we'd have gotten killed. I saw the thing unwinding and we all jumped out of the way. We were very fortunate that no one was killed there, but later there was some other man that had a little tractor up at the top, where the cable goes up there, and they have a little store deal, where you get out and look around, and you're way high.

It was a very high, and there was cables that pulled you up, and cables that hooked on the other way that let you down, and they could run these two hoist engines bolted together. It was a simple thing to an engineer, but it was a complicated mechanism. We had to speak over the radio to tell the hoist man to raise or lower the thing, but the 55 gallon bucket, they used it before they used the skiff, and they couldn't use a man there, and that thing would rise, and on the North side of the road, it would take us clear up and over eleven hundred and twenty-nine feet, I believe, up to where the length between. It was really a tremendous job, and Alan Whitehead did it, he was really the builder of the thing, did a really fantastic job of building that Bridal Veil Falls Sky Ride. I worked for him. And I was up there and welded way up there.

MB: Now, you said that you worked on the Salt Lake Temple?

DAT: I worked on the Salt Lake Temple, it was remodeling time, and they did some changing, and I built some hand rails out of aluminum, and also some out of steel, and I worked for two different companies. I worked for Toledo Metal Arts, and we took the oxen down that was made of cast iron, that held the baptistery basin, and I worked inside the temple proper. We had to have a temple recommend to go inside, and show it every day when you went in.

MB: Did you ever forget it?

DAT: Oh, no. And we'd go in the morning and work and go home about four o'clock or four thirty. Anyway, we changed the hand railings and the scrollwork on the doors, on the East and West sides of the temple and we did anodizing of some aluminum hand rails, and rail guards. We put in some stairways, and changed a bunch of stuff.

I worked about three months for one company, I don't remember now just how long I worked for Metals Manufacturing, which did the lighting inside. I was in there, and the temple was shut down, the whole block area was closed off to the public. However, up on the fourth floor, I think it was the fourth floor, the First Presidency and the Twelve would meet with the First Quorum of the Seventy, and the presidents, and they still do, on Thursday. We took the oxen all apart and melted the bronze rod over them with acetylene and oxygen, and sprayed them so they looked golden.

MB: So those oxen are wrought iron, then, covered with bronze.

DAT: They're cast iron, not wrought iron. But the scroll work was wrought iron. And we changed doorways and steps, and I built some steps, and we'd make parts and take them in and install them, and I did some welding on that visitor's center, at this time they use that visitors center to enter in to the temple. At various stages the work was done, and all custom work. It was very enjoyable. I went clear to the top, and in fact I went clear up and was on top of the temple, on the West end, I had to crawl up a ladder, but I never went over to the East end, and I could have, but there was just three of us working, and I never did get close enough to see the Angel Moroni, the statue, in fact I could have, in fact I talked to the engineer a couple of days later, and I said, I'd like to go up and see the angel. And he said We'll take you when you have time. But I never did have time.

MB: Now I understand that when that statue of Moroni was originally made, there was a hole in the back of his head, and when the wind blew just right, his trumpet would blow sometimes.

DAT: The trumpet, when I was