Import Your Ideas

IMPORT YOUR IDEAS

Ted Pouliot

iUniverse, Inc.

Bloomington

IMPORT YOUR IDEAS

Copyright © 2013 Ted Pouliot.

All rights reserved. No part of this book may be used or reproduced by any means, graphic, electronic, or mechanical, including photocopying, recording, taping or by any information storage retrieval system without the written permission of the publisher except in the case of brief quotations embodied in critical articles and reviews.

iUniverse books may be ordered through booksellers or by contacting:

iUniverse

1663 Liberty Drive

Bloomington, IN 47403

www.iuniverse.com

1-800-Authors (1-800-288-4677)

Because of the dynamic nature of the Internet, any web addresses or links contained in this book may have changed since publication and may no longer be valid. The views expressed in this work are solely those of the author and do not necessarily reflect the views of the publisher, and the publisher hereby disclaims any responsibility for them.

Any people depicted in stock imagery provided by Thinkstock are models, and such images are being used for illustrative purposes only.

Certain stock imagery © Thinkstock.

ISBN: 978-1-4759-8193-3 (sc)

ISBN: 978-1-4759-8195-7 (hc)

ISBN: 978-1-4759-8194-0 (e)

Library of Congress Control Number: 2013905657

iUniverse rev. date: 4/25/2013

Table of Contents

ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS

INTRODUCTION

To present a broad picture of what is involved in Importing, the Author has divided this book into three parts:

PART I Nick and Laura — A Tale of Two Importers

This fictionalized tale takes you from college days to their eventual success as importers. Learn tricks of the trade by following two creative people in their travels.

CHAPTER ONE

CHAPTER TWO

CHAPTER THREE

CHAPTER FOUR

CHAPTER FIVE

CHAPTER SIX

CHAPTER SEVEN

CHAPTER EIGHT

CHAPTER NINE

CHAPTER TEN

CHAPTER ELEVEN

CHAPTER TWELVE

CHAPTER THIRTEEN

CHAPTER FOURTEEN

CHAPTER FIFTEEN

CHAPTER SIXTEEN

CHAPTER SEVENTEEN

CHAPTER EIGHTEEN

CHAPTER NINETEEN

CHAPTER TWENTY

CHAPTER TWENTY-ONE

CHAPTER TWENTY-TWO

CHAPTER TWENTY-THREE

CHAPTER TWENTY-FOUR

CHAPTER TWENTY-FIVE

CHAPTER TWENTY-SIX

CHAPTER TWENTY-SEVEN

CHAPTER TWENTY-EIGHT

PART II: Details and Guidelines

The how to of importing, including many references, in which the forms and procedures guide you to a productive beginning.

INTRODUCTION (Part II)

ESTABLISHING AN IMPORT BUSINESS

WAYS TO ORGANIZE YOUR BUSINESS

IMPLICATIONS OF ENTITY TYPE

FINANCING

CURRENCY FLUCTUATION

CLAIMS

CONTAINERIZATION

PACKING

SOURCING

IS A RETAIL DISCOUNT ALWAYS A DISCOUNT?

SHOOT FOR THE MOON

AID TO ARTISANS

LABELING REQUIREMENTS

CATALOGS

COLOR

COLOR MARKETING GROUP

NEGOTIATING

CONTRACTS

TYPES OF IMPORTERS

Product Designers

Working with Architects

Client Accompaniment

Retail Buyers’ Philosophy

Innovation

Importing of Parts for U.S. Assembly

Diversification… Beware

Trading Companies

MY BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT

FRANCHISE

PRODUCT SELECTION

NEW PRODUCT DEVELOPMENT

INVENTORY CONTROL SYSTEM

VENDOR PROFILE

COMMUNICATION

NETWORKING

BUSINESS CARD/STATIONERY

UNITED STATES IMPORTERS – FORMERLY FOREIGN EXPORTERS

PRIVATE LABEL LINES

EXCLUSIVITY AGREEMENTS

SEARCH FOR A FACTORY TO PRODUCE CUSTOM DESIGNS

JOINT VENTURES

QUOTATIONS

DEADLINES

ACCOUNTING

PAYMENT SYSTEMS

EXAMPLE OF IMPORT COST

INSURANCE

TARIFFS

PROHIBITIONS

PATENTS

TRADEMARKS

TRADE SECRETS

COPYRIGHTS

ENFORCEMENTS

INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY RIGHTS

BEIJING-BASED AMERICAN CONSULTANT

LEAD CONTENT

RISK MITIGATION

LICENSING

QUOTAS

BONDED WAREHOUSE

SAMPLES

DUMPING

CUSTOMS BROKER

STANDARD CUSTOMS BROKERS QUOTATION FORM

INFORMED COMPLIANCE PUBLICATIONS

CUSTOMS MANAGEMENT CENTERS

U.S. CUSTOMS OFFICERS IN FOREIGN COUNTRIES

U.S. CUSTOMS OFFICERS – Continued

FOREIGN TRADE SHOWS

DOMESTIC TRADE SHOWS / MERCHANDISE MARTS

The China Question

China Facts

China props up exports

CHINESE EMPLOYMENT

BIG-BOX COMPANY INSPECTORS

FACTORY WAGES

Gifts

Travel in China

HONG KONG AIRPORT FREQUENT VISITOR CARD

ENTERTAINMENT

TRAVEL TIPS

SALES

GLOSSARY

Books and Publications

AUTHOR’S COMMENTS

PART III: My Importing Travels

Experiences in seventeen countries present an insight into the people, places and opportunities observed by an importer.

HONG KONG AND CHINA

BANGLADESH

BAHRAIN

COSTA RICA

ENGLAND

GUATEMALA

HAITI

INDIA

ITALY

JAPAN

KOREA

PHILIPPINES

THAILAND

TONGA

TURKEY

TAIWAN

VIETNAM

In Conclusion

About the Author

Endnotes

Acknowledgements

For their advice and computer expertise, I want to thank my daughter, Catherine Anderson; daughter-in-law, Barbara Pouliot; grandson, Matt Anderson; sister-in-law, Irene Moore; and journalists, Paul Borzo and Neal St. Anthony.

Thanks to Tom Acklin, Bryce Peterson, Peter Gutheim and Gene Goodwin for the Import stories. And thanks to Jim Long for his encouragement.

Many thanks to my long-time friends and business associates in Hong Kong; Tony Lau, Joseph Chang, Patrick Koo, and Ted Katemopoulos, and to Sunny Limthongkul in Thailand.

INTRODUCTION

To present a broad picture of what is involved in Importing, the Author has divided this book into three parts:

Ideas are the magic ingredient for success in importing. If your ideas fill needs in a better way you are half way to success in importing.

Part I of this book, Nick and Laura – a tale of two importers, takes you through importing experiences portrayed in a way that allows you to peer into the minds of two people developing their importing expertise.

Part II presents working guidelines and references for further study.

Part III takes you through my travels in seventeen countries in search of new products and ideas. This book is written for those interested in how importers develop and sell products.

A growing number of companies find importing to be a necessary part of remaining competitive. It is fine to buy American, but many products cannot be made in the United States and compete in a world market, where labor costs can be as much as ten times lower.

Many importers transfer their buying from country to country for lower labor costs. The global economy cannot be reversed. Read Thomas Friedman’s book The World is Flat1. Importers must relate to a world market. Years ago we talked about which of the United States was the leading source for a particular product. Now we talk about which country. Importers attend trade shows the world over to keep up with the latest trends that will eventually envelop the world.

Not many years ago retailers bought from importers who inventoried their goods for quick shipment. In recent years the Big Box retailers, whose volume exceeds the traditional importer, have instigated their own direct importing.

My first trip to Asia taught me the advantages of working directly in a manufacturer’s showroom and factory as opposed to placing orders from quotations and samples without leaving my office. Only in person can you see everything available from a source and better negotiate price, quality and shipping details.

If you enjoy travel and want the opportunity to develop and market your ideas, then importing can be a rewarding career.

My importing experience started with one 20’ container shipment and grew to four or five 40’ container shipments per month.

Later I went on to help my worldwide factories under license with their importing. International trade is not new. It dates back to 2000 BC, between Greece and Rome. By the fifth century AD, Egypt, Syria, India and China were engaged very strongly in international trade. Spain, Portugal, and Holland were involved by the fifteenth century. The discovery of America was the beginning of a whole new world of extensive overseas trade.

The beginning of the eighteen hundreds was the start of a world economy, in a system that has grown ever since. This growth has not been without problems, especially with the emergence of tariff wars. Tariff disputes still continue between many countries.

In 1944, allied countries established an International Monetary Fund (IMF) whose aim was to facilitate global trade by establishing fixed exchange rates.

It was a surprise to learn:

• The volume of world trade in 2004 tripled from 1990 and now exceeds $ eleven trillion.

• Most small countries are involved in international trade.

• China joined the W.T.O. (World Trade Organization) in 2001. Since joining, their imports have doubled.

• In 2011 the United States Federal Government collected 28.61 billion dollars in duties on dutiable import value of 2 trillion 186 million dollars. Dutiable imports, in turn, represented thirty-one percent of all imports. ²

China believes trade is its most important endeavor and therefore does everything it can to promote its manufacturing sector. Few people are aware that the Chinese government gives its manufacturers a subsidy on all exports. The amount is based on product category and varies over time. Many competing countries consider this an unfair trade practice.

Those involved in importing can include import companies and also buyers, designers and specifiers (those who designate particular products).

PART I

Nick and Laura —

A Tale of Two Importers

This fictionalized tale takes you from college days to their eventual success as importers. Learn tricks of the trade by following two creative people in their travels.

Chapter One

Nick Barton had grown up in a small town in New York State. He came from a typical middle class family. His father was a dentist and his mother an artist. His only sister was a sophomore in high school. Nick had been a star athlete in school and exceptionally popular.

In his early years, Nick never gave much thought to his career, except that it should be challenging and people oriented. As his grades were high, he had no trouble getting into Cornell University in Ithaca, New York.

Nick’s parents never pressed him on a career choice. They knew he was hard working and encouraged him to pursue a career in which he would be happy.

Having graduated from high school Nick was saving as much money as possible for college. While in high school he worked three hours each evening in Nacy’s maintenance department. By the time he’d received his high school diploma, Nick had worked his way up to a job in sales, and he continued working as a salesperson the following summer.

He liked working in the men’s department where trends and styles were constantly being updated. He learned the importance of display in retailing, and asked the display people many questions.

One day, Nick was hurrying to get to work on time at Nacy’s. He jumped onto the curb just as a sleek, emerald-green Jaguar sped down the street, driven by a distinguished-looking man.

Later that day, he spotted the man he had seen in the green Jaguar walking through the store. The man came into the men’s department and asked Nick about some shirts. Nick pointed out the features of every shirt in the department and even recommended neckties. The man bought two shirts and two ties. Nick spotted a new sport coat that had just come in that would be perfect for him. The man bought the coat. Nick told him he was Nick Barton, thanked him and gave him is card. The man then gave Nick his card and Nick was astounded that it was Mr. Edward Harder, Vice-President of Nacy’s Department Store.

Mr. Harder said, I’m in town for meetings relative to a new store-wide salesmanship training course and was very impressed with your salesmanship. Nick, you could have a good future with the store. I‘ll watch your progress.

Nick explained that he was going to college in the fall.

Mr. Harder said he hoped Nick would take courses that would help his retailing career. Nick really had not settled on a career choice. As enjoyable as his summer job was, he knew he didn’t want to work behind a counter all his life.

By midsummer Nick was the top salesperson in the men’s department. Esther and Abigail had worked at Nacy’s for twenty years. They said to Mr. Lewis, their supervisor, Nick is a sales grabber.

Mr. Lewis said, I’ll keep a sharp eye on the department. A week later Mr. Lewis said to the women, If you didn’t spend so much time talking to each other, you could spread out and be more receptive to the customers, which would result in more sales.

Knowing how the women felt, Nick spent some time with them. He explained how his sales approach led to multiple sales. They all got along better and won a department award.

In the fall Nick went off to Cornell University. Although Nick’s career goals were focused on Business and Marketing, he found himself majoring in a Liberal Arts field for a well-rounded education. He had many bull sessions with the guys in his dorm. They talked about the department store and retailing experiences in general.

His good friend, Bill Anderson, was in business and marketing. They had many conversations on real-life experiences not addressed in their textbooks. Bill said, Nick, do you know the origin of all those products?

Nick replied, In the men’s department most of the labels were tagged ‘Made in China’ with a few from Thailand, Bangladesh, Guatemala and other countries.

They talked about whether the big stores went to those countries themselves or bought from the traditional importers. The conversation went on to costing, tariffs and other importing details. They soon realized they didn’t have many answers.

***

Laura grew up on Long Island, New York. Her father was a set designer on Broadway, and her mother an actress who kept very busy playing a variety of minor and supporting roles. As her parents were often working long and irregular hours, Laura and her younger brother learned to keep busy on their own.

Laura was a beautiful, sharp-featured girl with lustrous black hair. Through her parents’ contacts she could have majored in acting and lighted up a Broadway stage.

Laura started painting classes in her junior year in high school and soon her art took up all her spare time. Laura was always interested in exploring the process in which she could express herself creatively in painting or related arts.

Her grades were good, but when she started college she had yet to decide on a career. Her parents did not encourage her to follow their complex lives in the theater.

***

Laura Caldwell and Nick had several classes together during their sophomore year. Laura was leaning toward the jewelry business, while Nick was still thinking about the department store or other retail trade.

They began dating and found that they had a lot in common. Although they were both raised in small towns in New York, they had loved occasional trips into Manhattan with their parents.

Their mutual interests in college courses brought them together often for lunch or coffee. Besides a strong physical attraction, they found that they both had a desire for careers working with people in a creative business. Before long, their relationship became serious, but they both knew they had to finish school and might be separated for long periods of time.

Laura wanted to be involved in all phases of the jewelry business, including the creative element. Laura was fascinated by the fact that all countries designed and produced some type of jewelry. She wondered how many of them exported, how many sold mainly precious stones, and how many imported gold, silver, or platinum. Laura also wanted to know how the successful jewelry stores functioned. Did she want to be involved only in the wholesale and importing aspect? Did she want to learn and practice jewelry design? Laura wanted to know everything.

Nick said, You could work for a jeweler summers and on holiday break. I could try to get you a job in the jewelry department at Nacy’s—that way we could see each other more often.

Laura appreciated Nick’s offer but found a summer and holiday job at Seascape Jewelers in the Hamptons close to her home. The store was located on a picturesque street in a tourist area. The exterior was red brick with elegant coach lamps flanking the entrance. Beautiful glass cases edged in brass graced the interior. An alcove displayed antique and custom jewelry.

The first summer at the jewelry store was more interesting and exciting than she had imagined. She learned the usage of the materials, and their names, including precious and semi-precious stones.

Mr. Steinman, the owner, was also an accomplished artist and created imaginative contemporary and traditional settings with diamonds and precious stones.

By the end of the summer Laura was sure this was the profession for her.

In school the next year she spent all her spare time in the library and on the internet doing research on the materials used in the jewelry trade.

Nick was happy with his courses at Cornell and decided to stay on and graduate. He felt that as far as retailing was concerned, he was learning the business at the department store. At Nacy’s he spent all the time he could talking to the buyers, office personnel and display people, while holding down his summer sales job.

***

One sunny day in the spring of their sophomore year Nick and Laura took a long walk along the river. Cornell’s campus, with its rolling hills, gorges, lakes and rivers, is the most beautiful of all the Ivy League schools.

Both loved nature and sat on a bench by the river watching the water tumble over giant boulders.

Nick said, What a place to go to school. It’s like being in a state park.

Laura’s thoughts seemed to wander, and she finally said, Sometimes I wish we were finished with school and could start our careers together now in New York City.

Nick replied, I’d love that too, but with all we have ahead of us I don’t dare ask you to marry me, although I’d really love to.

Oh, Nick, I’d love to marry you. I wish the time were right. So many couples marry too soon, have children, and never fulfill their career choice. We can be smarter than that. I have decided to transfer next year to Syracuse University in Syracuse, New York. The university has one of the best jewelry curriculums in their college of Visual and Performing Arts. I found that the University itself has a good undergraduate program in Business Management. At Syracuse I will learn all about the business, as well as learn the art and craft of actually designing jewelry.

Nick said, "I’m disappointed that you won’t be here next year, but understand your decision. I want to meet somewhere during summer and holiday break.

***

The next summer Laura worked again at the jewelry store and Nick at the department store.

Nick kept thinking about Laura’s idea that they could someday both be involved in importing. The next year he could not get the idea out of his mind. In talking with the buyers at the store he had learned that all of the importing decisions were centered in the New York office.

In his men’s department it was hard to tell what Nacy’s imported and what Nacy’s bought through importers. By law all imports had to be clearly labeled with the country of origin. Those manufactured in the United States were also labeled, mostly as a buying incentive.

Nick and Laura were both so busy that summer that they did not have the chance or money to see each other. They did keep in touch by email, Facebook and, of course, cell phone.

That fall Laura was happy to be in college in a department helpful to her chosen career. In many ways she missed Cornell and, of course, missed Nick.

During the year Laura was trying to decide what part of the jewelry business she would prefer. She liked retail because of the customer contact. It was a considerable benefit to have watched her customers’ jewelry decisions. Often they would say what they wanted. Laura would then show a selection she thought was appropriate. If the customers were not receptive, she would then offer to have a design created. As this would add to the cost, it seldom resulted in a sale. With such a variety of customers all summer, Laura learned to spot trends and noticed which designs resulted in the highest customer satisfaction.

She hoped someday her designs would set trends, and not just be copies. She realized that retail experience was very beneficial, but it did not fulfill her creative expectations. She felt a wholesale business that included exclusive designs and importing would be a better choice.

After her third year in college Laura was able to help Mr. Steinman at Seascape Jewelers with some custom designs. At sixty-years old, Mr. Steinman seemed overworked. He had an impressive following and was always behind on custom design orders. His wife, Olga, did the bookkeeping and answered the phone.

It was a very busy summer and Mr. Steinman was happy to have her help. He appreciated all she had learned in her jewelry-making courses. Laura was even more convinced that jewelry would be her future.

After Laura graduated from college she obtained a job at Feinwell’s Wholesale Jewelry in New York City. She was happy that it was an easy thirty-minute commute to her parents’ home on Long Island. She loved her home. It was a unique blend of furnishings comprised of pieces from her father’s Broadway set designs and her mother’s paintings. The home was once featured in a local magazine. She did not feel she was ready for her own apartment until she saved enough money.

Her beginning position involved working with their retail accounts. The company employed several jewelry designers and Laura was anxious to move into that position.

Chapter Two

In the middle of his senior year at Cornell, Nick contacted Edward Harder at Nacy’s Home Office in New York. Mr. Harder had been sending Nick periodic Nacy’s store bulletins showing new stores and events.

Nick said, Mr. Harder, I am hoping a good position with the store is available for me.

Mr. Harder’s answer was quick. He said, Nick, come to the Flagship Store in New York City when you finish school. I would like to place you in several departments to determine which would be appropriate. You could have a great future at Nacy’s.

After graduation in June, Nick received a warm welcome from Mr. Harder. He took Nick to lunch in Nacy’s upscale Grillroom. The Grillroom was known for chicken coq au vin. After finishing his plate, Nick said, I’ve never had such tasty chicken. I’d love to take Laura here someday.

Mr. Harder replied, I’m glad you like it. I thought it was time that we should sit down and talk about your future. I want to start you in the Housewares and Gift department to see if it would be a good fit. After a time in sales to acquaint you with the merchandise, there may be an assistant buyer opening. If the department does not interest you, we can try another.

After a few months Nick thoroughly knew the merchandise. He liked the selection, but after talking with many customers, Nick felt improvements could be made.

Nick reported to a supervisor by the name of Alex Conroy. Nick and Alex became good colleagues.

After two months on the job, Alex introduced Nick to Mr. Jim Baldwin, the head buyer. He was the buyer for all 110 stores in the chain, with an office on the floor above. He was born in London, and was an assistant buyer for Harrods before working his way up at Nacy’s.

Mr. Baldwin said, I heard from both Alex Conroy and Mr. Harder that you are a top salesman.

Nick said, Once I learn a product and like it, the sales are easy.

After a few months Mr. Baldwin called Nick into his office. I see the Color Marketing Group is conducting a week long seminar on color in merchandising in Boston this May. It would be lovely if you would attend.

Nick was surprised but willing to learn. He felt he already had a good color sense but could learn more.

Mr. Baldwin explained, A good color education is very important in all phases of retailing and a continuing learning process on how color is applied. I suggest you read the better home décor magazines and attend open houses professionally decorated real estate offerings. Mr. Baldwin was well versed in the subject and said, Nick, you should know trends often start in Europe in women’s fashions and in many cases work down to home décor. Color forecasting groups are comprised of members from many industries in which color is very important. The colors planned for new merchandise are reported to the color groups a year or more before their introduction.

Nick asked, You mean that designers of new products report the colors they will actually be using on the new introductions?

Yes, and this is quite helpful to importers who also need to work many months in advance. Color trends emerging in high end products do not always reach mass-market merchandise. The color forecasters often categorize colors in groups by the certainty of popularity.

Nick was confused and said, Does a store buyer think it might be risky to buy too many products in a new color until he is sure of its acceptance?

Absolutely, it is best to first order new colors on just a few groupings, and then extend the color to more products if well accepted. Sometimes a color, such as mauve, stays too long in the mass market. It poses a problem for the retail buyer as its popularity has left the middle and high market, yet needs to still be addressed in the lower end market. Many retailers try to pull away from such colors by offering complimentary colors that can be used with the old color. This is helpful for the consumer still using a product, in this case mauve, and could brighten up the mauve by adding a product in burgundy, magenta or purple. Most shoppers are attracted first by color, and then materials and style.

The Pantone color system is used worldwide and provides color communication by Pantone numbers with manufactures. Books of hundreds of color chips are available for purchase stratagems. [See color section, Part Two]

Nick was wondering why Mr. Baldwin was going into such detail, and hoping it was to prepare him for a promotion.

Chapter Three

Meanwhile Laura was happy working at Feinwell’s, as it was a further learning experience.

After Laura left Cornell, Nick had dated a number of girls but found none as fascinating and attractive as Laura. Now that they were both working in New York they had lunch together often.

Sometimes they would just pick up a hot dog and drink at a corner stand and take it with them to a quiet bench in Central Park. If they were in a hurry coffee and a snack at Starbuck’s would suffice. If they were really hungry, they indulged in something more at Carnegie Deli.

Nick found a studio apartment in Chelsea that he found very expensive for its size, but this was not uncommon in New York.

Their dinner dates were right after work, as Laura still had the long train ride to her parent’s home on Long Island. For dinner they preferred any of the mid-town Italian or Japanese restaurants. When they had time it was Pellegrino’s in Little Italy or Joe’s Shanghai in Chinatown. In the Village, The Place was a favorite. They both knew that if a restaurant was to stay open in New York it had to be good–the only big differences were in style and price.

Nick and Laura shared their work experiences and discussed future possibilities. Nick was worried that in working for an operation as large as Nacy’s he might be transferred to another city.

Laura said, Well, my dream is to eventually have my own jewelry importing business, which should be in New York City.

They both loved the city and hoped it would always be their home. Their relationship was becoming serious, but having only been in New York City for a few months they felt the need to be secure in their work.

Both had strong career goals, but Nick realized that Laura’s were more defined. He admired her ambition and determination to be not only an importer but also an important jewelry designer.

They were following careers of choice, based not as much on monetary potential as on creative marketing and product development. Both felt the importance of their need to enjoy their work and develop their full potential.

Laura was finally given the chance to assist Claudette, the head jewelry designer. Claudette needed an assistant. Because of the popularity of her work, she was always behind.

Claudette had worked at Feinwell’s for over ten years. She had no previous jewelry experience, but slowly worked her way up in the company. She was what is commonly called a natural designer, so after learning the mechanics of the trade by assisting others, she was gradually allowed to create her own work.

Laura still had to help some walk-in trade, but half her time was now spent working with Claudette. She learned the basics at school but working with an artist like Claudette expanded her imagination. After being in the trade for many years, she had built a reputation with leading jewelers. On occasion she would meet with a jeweler’s client for a specialized design.

Once a year, Claudette would accompany Mr. Feinwell on an Asian buying trip. The trip would take them to Hong Kong, Shanghai, Bangkok, New Delhi and Bombay. Resources offered them exquisite precious and semi-precious stones as well as pearls. Their diamond resource came to them from South Africa.

Upon examining the gems they brought back, Laura was intrigued with the possibilities and knew she would like to be an importer.

Chapter Four

Nick reported back to Mr. Baldwin after completing the color seminar in Boston. He said, I appreciated the course and everything I learned should be very helpful.

Mr. Baldwin said, I’m preparing you to be my assistant. My former assistant buyer has given notice, and I dare say, I need to fill the position quickly. Do you want the challenge? Before